Macintosh Animation Showcase/Macintosh Animation Showcase CD-ROM.iso/FORUM/803-867

Text File | 1988-07-12 | 40.6 KB | 1,123 lines | [TEXT/MSWD]

#: 803 S3/CDROM Applications
    22-Jun-88  21:43:34
Sb: #800-#ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: bob helfant 75530,214
To: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271 (X)

The Blue Sail disk is another 1000 floppies of public domain shareware.  What
CD are you about to press?  Bob Helfant



There is 1 Reply.

#: 804 S3/CDROM Applications
    22-Jun-88  21:44:51
Sb: #801-CDROM AUDIO
Fm: bob helfant 75530,214
To: Singing Electrons/Tom J. 73717,2261 (X)

Our catalog is on the way.  Bob Helant

#: 805 S3/CDROM Applications
    22-Jun-88  21:52:06
Sb: #802-CDROM AUDIO
Fm: bob helfant 75530,214
To: Pete Jacobsen 72307,2416 (X)

Does this mean that you don't want to order the Registry of Mass Spectral Data?
Our catalog is missing a few disks that we sell, but as it stands, it lists
more than 7 Cds.  We also carry the Oxford English Dictionary (1 or 2 CDs), a
disk of stock photos for use with desktop publishing ware, and a few disks full
of public domain shareware.  The other hundred or so CDs that have been pressed
are for specific industries.  We try to address a horizontal market in our
advertising and also list things like the registry to let people know that we
also carry specialty items. Bob Helfant

#: 806 S3/CDROM Applications
    25-Jun-88  01:30:22
Sb: #803-#ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271
To: bob helfant 75530,214 (X)

Bob -

We're about to press the BMUG PD ROM(tm), a collection of about 300-some megs
of Macintosh publically distributable software - shareWare, public domain, and
freeware.  Sorted, tested, organized, indexed.  HFS format disc.  Right now
looks like we'll press on July 8th.

-- Raines Cohen / BMUG

There are 2 Replies.

#: 807 S3/CDROM Applications
    25-Jun-88  15:25:38
Sb: #806-#ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: Vic Wagner/Metadigm 76046,3004
To: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271 (X)

What software did you use to index it?  Is the source available?  My club is
considering putting a disk together for the Amiga and would appreciate any
suggestions you may have.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 808 S1/General Information
    26-Jun-88  09:09:39
Sb: #Greetings
Fm: Ronald Nutter 73605,612
To: All

Greetings,  This is Ron Nutter in Lexington,Ky.  I am the sysop of a club
sponsored board Bluegrass RBBS (606)-272-0499.  I recently installed a CD-ROM
drive on my board (an AMDEK Laserdrive-1) and a CD-ROM from ALDE Publishing.
This gives my board 670 megs online.  Being new to CD-ROM's I have a lot to
learn and hope that I can contribute as well.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 809 S3/CDROM Applications
    26-Jun-88  18:42:43
Sb: #807-#ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271
To: Vic Wagner/Metadigm 76046,3004 (X)

Vic -

Sorry, our indexing stuff is very Mac-directory-structure specific, and
integrated with HyperCard.  Good luck!

-- Raines / BMUG

There is 1 Reply.

#: 810 S3/CDROM Applications
    27-Jun-88  04:20:54
Sb: #809-ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: Vic Wagner/Metadigm 76046,3004
To: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271 (X)

Thanks, I'm not looking forward to indexing all of those docs, but it's gotta
be done.



#: 811 S3/CDROM Applications
    27-Jun-88  19:27:08
Sb: #ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: William E. Fein 72261,1642
To: members

To: ALL CD-ROM FORUM MEMBERS Fm: William Fein, Information Access Co. Su: New
CD-ROM from Ziff Davis Publishing

Ziff-Davis Publishing introduced a new CD-ROM product at Spring COMDEX in May.
The product is called The Computer Library and includes abstracts of articles
from over 120 computer publications such as Computerworld, Infoworld,
InformationWeek, and PC World. It also includes abstracts AND the fulltext from
the following publications:


          PC Week                    PC Magazine
          PC Tech Journal            Digital Review
          MacUser                    Microsoft Systems Journal
          Lotus Magazine             Govt Computer News
          A+                         Communications of the ACM

It is priced at $695/yr plus $25 for S/H for 12 monthly disks. If you have any
questions about Computer Library pls leave them here.

Rgds, W. Fein

There is 1 Reply.

#: 812 S3/CDROM Applications
    27-Jun-88  22:16:26
Sb: #811-#ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: Mark Schneider 71330,467
To: William E. Fein 72261,1642 (X)

A few technical questions, if I may:  What kind of indexing system, retreival
engine and user interface do your disks have?  Proprietary (or commissioned) or
off-the-shelf?  Do your disks include graphics? Advertisements?   How were the
disks prepared in terms of digitizing the text - did you start with tapes from
the magazine publishers and strip out the typesetting codes, were you handed
pure ascii files, or did you do some mass O.C.R. scanning?  If you scanned the
printed material, what kind of equipment did you use?  Do you have a demo on
floppy?
                                       Thanks, Mark

There is 1 Reply.

#: 813 S3/CDROM Applications
    28-Jun-88  09:09:58
Sb: #812-#ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: J.S. Frentzen 76117,2127
To: Mark Schneider 71330,467 (X)

Computer Library is still vaporware and will not be out for at least a few more
months.  Luckily, Ziff Communications is open and aboveboard about that fact.
Unlike other companies, who say they have products available, but in fact do
not. -- Jeff Frentzen, CD-ROM Review

There is 1 Reply.

#: 814 S1/General Information
    28-Jun-88  16:10:42
Sb: #808-#Greetings
Fm: Karen Fletcher 72261,730
To: Ronald Nutter 73605,612 (X)

I would be *very* interested to hear how you are making your CD ROM available
through dialup.  We have a group of Executive MBAs who - because they're all
commuters - would like to be able to dial in to business databases on CD ROM at
the University.

I am only slightly familiar with BBS software.  Are you willing to share your
knowledge ?  I would really appreciate any help you can give us.

Thanks.

Karen Fletcher Commerce College, University of Illinois 72261,730 phone:
217-244-5000

There is 1 Reply.

#: 815 S3/CDROM Applications
    29-Jun-88  02:09:34
Sb: #813-#ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: Gary J. Ellis 71361,2427
To: J.S. Frentzen 76117,2127 (X)

Just to let you know that the Computer Library is shipping now to charter
subscribers.  The product is definetly not vaporware, it's excellent.  I ought
to know, I helped put it together. Regards, Gary

There is 1 Reply.

#: 816 S1/General Information
    30-Jun-88  00:34:48
Sb: #CDROM's
Fm: RUSSELL BRUDNICKI 76064,2452
To: All interested parties

To anyone that can help... The company I work for has developed a propriotary
SCSI interface and MSDOS driver. We are looking for information on the
requirements for interfacing CDROM devices on the SCSI interface under MSDOS.
Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thanks   Russ

There is 1 Reply.

#: 817 S3/CDROM Applications
    30-Jun-88  09:20:02
Sb: #815-#ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: Karen Fletcher 72261,730
To: Gary J. Ellis 71361,2427 (X)

How does one become a charter subscriber?

There are 2 Replies.

#: 819 S3/CDROM Applications
    30-Jun-88  19:02:23
Sb: #ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: William E. Fein 72261,1642
To: mark schneider

A few technical answers:

   1) Indexing of Computer Library (CL) is done by staff of trained
      abstractors and indexers using controlled vocabulary. The
      vocabulary is same as the one used for IAC's online database,
      The Computer Database available on DIALOG & BRS.

   2) Retrieval engine is the Lotus Bluefish Searchware that allows
      keyword and boolean searching.

   3) I'm not sure what you mean about user interface. Please clarify.

   4) Further information can be provided by contacting Ziff
      Communications at:
                         One Park Ave
                         NY, NY 10016
                         (212) 503 -4400

rgds, W. Fein

There is 1 Reply.

#: 820 S3/CDROM Applications
    30-Jun-88  19:23:07
Sb: #817-ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: Gary J. Ellis 71361,2427
To: Karen Fletcher 72261,730 (X)

Hi Karen -To subscribe to the Computer Library, call 212-503-4400.  Charter
subscribers will receive charter/beta disks monthly until about August, at
which time the clock on the annual subscription starts ticking.  In effect,
you'll get one or two free months. Regards, Gary PS:  An annual subscription is
priced at $695, plus s&h.

#: 821 S3/CDROM Applications
    30-Jun-88  19:40:50
Sb: #754-#CD ROM LAN access
Fm: Gary J. Ellis 71361,2427
To: Karen Fletcher 72261,730 (X)

Hi Karen -- Regarding your question about network access to CD-ROM drives, I've
just attended a demonstration of Merdian's network CD-ROM server.  Impressive
and reasonably priced.  Contact Mike Rynas, Network Sales Manager, Meridian, at
408-476-8908 (CA). Tell him I sent you.  Regards, Gary

There is 1 Reply.

#: 822 S3/CDROM Applications
    30-Jun-88  21:39:14
Sb: #819-ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: Mark Schneider 71330,467
To: William E. Fein 72261,1642 (X)

William -

Thanks for the reply.  Bluefish is one of the programs I'm very interested in
myself, and have been since before Computer Access was swallowed up by Lotus.
After the acquisition Lotus proceded to yank the product off the shelf (or so I
thought), and my calls to Lotus about its re-release met silence.  Are you
happy with the program in its present incarnation?  Did you compare it to other
software, such as ZyIndex, that does pretty much the same thing, even though it
wasn't designed specifically for optical media?

Interesting that you have human indexers; I thought Bluefish and similar
products build an index automatically (an "inverted" index which excludes
"noise" words or "stop" words and points to every location of every significant
word).  Do the people select the significant words for Bluefish to index and
have it exclude all other words?

Re the user interface: what I meant was how it appears to the user and how he
manipulates it, online help screens, function key use, mouse use, how "computer
literate" a user must be vs. how intuitive the program is.  I realize that the
content of your database naturally appeals to people knowledgable about
computers, but for a product I have in mind that would not be true necessarily.

Finally, (sorry this is so long!), did you use O.C.R. scanning to build the raw
digital text or did you start with the text in digital form?  If scanned, what
equipment did you use?

                                  Thanks for all,  Mark



#: 823 S3/CDROM Applications
    30-Jun-88  23:13:57
Sb: #821-#CD ROM LAN access
Fm: Mark Schneider 71330,467
To: Gary J. Ellis 71361,2427 (X)

Gary -

Why is it that a special subsystem is required for networking a CD-ROM drive?
If it appears as just another DOS device under the MS extensions and device
drivers, why can't the drives just be hooked onto any old network server with
non-proprietary disk format (such as 3Com+), or, better yet, shared by all
nodes on an ordinary P.C. under a distributed resource sharing operating system
(such as Tops)?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 824 S1/General Information
    30-Jun-88  23:29:03
Sb: Savvy Newcomer
Fm: David Gilliland 76340,2346
To: all

Hello, I am sure glad to see a forum for optical products. I am David
Gilliland. I have been working for Imageering Optical Disk Systems for the past
three years. We have been working on the storage of both text, document images,
and color photos with great success. This system which is a multi media
database permits all types of information to be stored on the same disc. I feel
the application of this technology to CDROM is limitless, however the market
flexibility is limited. The company has focused on WORM drives for vertical
market applications. I would like to understand a bit more about the CDROM
indexing format, where can I get this info. I am also interested in other
companies who have focused on CD-ROM with mixed color photo and text
information. I look forward to getting to "know" more of the players in this
forum.

#: 825 S3/CDROM Applications
    01-Jul-88  09:02:38
Sb: #817-ZIFF-DAVIS CD-ROM PROD
Fm: J.S. Frentzen 76117,2127
To: Karen Fletcher 72261,730 (X)

F.Y.I. "charter" means "beta test" -- the product will not be ready for public
consumption until later this year. -- Jeff /l

#: 826 S1/General Information
    01-Jul-88  09:54:18
Sb: #CDROM
Fm: Dave Pushic 74775,1345
To: Russell Brudnicki 76064,2452 (X)

Russ, For information on the Philips CD-ROM drives, these are handled through
Laser Magnetic Storage (719-593-7900), a joint venture of Philips and Control
Data.  Ask for Randy Hines.

Regards,


Dave Pushic

There is 1 Reply.

#: 827 S3/CDROM Applications
    01-Jul-88  11:38:39
Sb: #823-CD ROM LAN access
Fm: Gary J. Ellis 71361,2427
To: Mark Schneider 71330,467 (X)

Hi Mark -I'm certainly not an expert on networking CD-ROM drives; I think what
you're suggesting can be done, but performance might be unacceptable. What
Meridian is offering is in essence a PC (286 or 386) to which multiple CD
drives can be attached; the value added is some proprietary hardware (primarily
a cache system) and software that apparently improve performance. Regards, Gary

#: 828 S1/General Information
    02-Jul-88  02:37:47
Sb: Need Info about DVI!
Fm: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330
To: ALL

I am interested in finding the details of DVI technology.  All I have now
is that brochure I have obtained at the MS CDROM Conference this year.
Fortunately, one of my colleagues will come to Atlanta this summer for
SIGGRAPH and I am thinking of sending her to Princeton to find out more
about it. [I have not contacted with them yet.]  Meanwhile, I am wondering
if anybody who are developing or researching the technology will come to
Atlanta.  It is absolutely no info. in Japan except those who have special
connection with GE, I assume.  Any advise on this?  Or anybody from DVI
technology group to help me?
  -- Noboru Toyoshima [Hary & Company, Tokyo Japan]



#: 829 S1/General Information
    02-Jul-88  18:56:46
Sb: #826-CDROM
Fm: RUSSELL BRUDNICKI 76064,2452
To: Dave Pushic 74775,1345 (X)

Dave Thanks for the info, we will contact them. Thanks again Russ

#: 830 S3/CDROM Applications
    02-Jul-88  22:18:17
Sb: #as
Fm: Neil M. Ruggles 76266,3447
To: all

I am a Macintosh develop interested in publishing a number of CD-ROM titles. I
have researched buuild and search engines but most seem to be for the IBM PC
right now with Mac version sometime around the ebnd of the year.

Does anyone know of software toolkits or entire products that I can buy or
license to build and index CD-ROM disks for the Mac?

I am also quite interested in talking to other developers that think the
mainstream publishers are completely missing the boat by trying to sell C
CD-ROM to librarrians instead of end-users. I have a number of  specific ide
ideas for projects that I want to discuss with the right people.

There is 1 Reply.

#: 831 S1/General Information
    02-Jul-88  23:42:28
Sb: #814-Greetings
Fm: Ronald Nutter 73605,612
To: Karen Fletcher 72261,730 (X)

I would be very glad to offer what assistance that I can.  To put it in a
nutshell, i setup in rbbs what is called a sub-board(That is an environment
that is a bbs within a bbs) - this allows me to really restrict who has access
to the CDROM and for how long since the security levels and time restraints can
be changed and then restored upon returning to the main board. I m currently
using RBBS 16.1A.  I can be reached via my bbs (Bluegrass RBBS - 606-272-0499)
or by phone at home during the evenings 606-272-0489.

#: 832 S3/CDROM Applications
    02-Jul-88  23:47:12
Sb: CDROM on RBBS
Fm: Ronald Nutter 73605,612
To: Mike O'Bryan 71410,340 (X)

I have used fido for ver 8 months before switching to RBBS for 2 reasons. 1)
FIDO did not like Desqview multitasking software and did not perform netmail
functions with the modem I was using (which was hayes compat.) 2) I had
numerous security problems with FIDO (security had been broken on 2 occasions
and the security setup was not as flexible as I would have liked.  I setup the
cdrom as a sub-board within RBBS so that I could control access and keep it
more manageable.  It has been very easy to maintain so far.

#: 833 S3/CDROM Applications
    03-Jul-88  02:50:56
Sb: #830-as
Fm: Mark Schneider 71330,467
To: Neil M. Ruggles 76266,3447 (X)

Neil -

I have no experience with the Macintosh, but I believe that some existing or
any-day-now version of Hypercard will be standard for Mac/CD-ROM.   Seems to me
that Apple's philosophy is to standardize everything, and although there are
certainly benefits to that approach, it does limit developers and users.

And speaking of users, the reason I'm writing is that I wholeheartedly agree
with you that CD-ROM should be directed to the end-user rather than librarians.
It is coming within the budget of middle class individuals, and the whole
excitement of CD-ROM is the *DECENTRALIZATION* of knowledge, i.e. the exact
opposite of libraries!  And I have a specific application in mind, if you'd
like to discuss it some more - legal materials on disk designed and marketed
for small law firms or individual lawyers who don't want to pay the
outrageously expensive dial-up mainframe services.  Maybe we can help each
other?
                               Cheers,
                                       Mark

#: 834 S3/CDROM Applications
    03-Jul-88  05:27:06
Sb: #806-#ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330
To: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271 (X)

Raines,

I was filing business cards and I found yours.  Ah, I have seen you at the
CDROM Conference.... I thought our first meeting was on CompuServe but we
have seen each other in Seattle.
  By the way, is it possible for me to obtain the PD ROM by any chance?
You might have told me this before.... ummmm.
  Noboru Toyoshima
  Hary & Company, Tokyo Japan

There is 1 Reply.

#: 835 S2/Conference/Seminars
    03-Jul-88  05:27:23
Sb: CD-ROM EXPO?
Fm: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330
To: all

I heard that CD-ROM EXPO will be held in September.
What is it like?  Anybody know the details about it?
Should I come to see it?  Ummm.  -- Noboru Toyoshima

#: 836 S2/Conference/Seminars
    03-Jul-88  14:00:22
Sb: #CD-ROM EXPO?
Fm: bob helfant 75530,214
To: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330 (X)

The CD-ROM Expo in New York City last Fall was well worth attending if you
wanted to get information on a wide variety of CD-ROM products.  I would
imagine that the attendance in Chicago won't be quite as good as NY.  Should
you attend?  That depends where you have to fly in from and how much this
knowledge is worth to you.  By the way, did you ever receive a catalog from
CDP?  Bob Helfant

There is 1 Reply.

#: 837 S1/General Information
    03-Jul-88  22:22:37
Sb: Panasonic WORMs
Fm: Steve Hannaford 71131,1564
To: Pete Geyer 71211,2261

Pardon my curiosity, but why?

1. Why  are "Analog videodiscs currently the most efficient way to archive
thousands of "high quality" images."

2.Why are the quality of Mac II color graphics overlayed on top of a
videodisc output  better than a digitized Mac image?

Still learning this stuff.

#: 838 S2/Conference/Seminars
    04-Jul-88  22:06:36
Sb: #836-#CD-ROM EXPO?
Fm: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330
To: bob helfant 75530,214 (X)

Bob,
  Thanks for your reply.
My comapny produces interactive multimedia CDROMs and develops authoring
systems.  So I think I should come to the Expo anyway if my schedule allows me.
But on one hand, it is costly to fly from Tokyo.  So I've wanted to evaluate
if it's worth attending.  Do most of the software houses of CDROM and
manufacturers come to Chicago and display their new products?

What is CDP?  Could you tell me what the cagalog is about? -- Nobo

There is 1 Reply.

#: 839 S2/Conference/Seminars
    05-Jul-88  20:56:14
Sb: #838-CD-ROM EXPO?
Fm: bob helfant 75530,214
To: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330 (X)

Nobo, Many of the manufacturers and publishers attended last year in New York.
Perhaps if you speak to the people who are "putting on" the show, they will
give you a list of attendees.  Thier address is CD ROM Expo, P.O. Box 9171,
Framingham, MA 01701-9171 . CDP is Compact Disk Products.  It is a company in
New York that sells and supports many of the CD ROM / WORM hardware and
software products which are currently available. Bob

#: 840 S3/CDROM Applications
    05-Jul-88  22:41:17
Sb: #CD-ROM video
Fm: CHUCK SMITH 71641,3411
To: ALL

Hello, I'm interested in current CD-ROM limitations in motion video.  Want to
develop a history curriculum with manuscript images, sound, and some video.
Any info. would be gratefully recv'd.   -- Chuck

There is 1 Reply.

#: 841 S3/CDROM Applications
    05-Jul-88  23:28:50
Sb: #726-CD Test
Fm: Brian Nielsen 72411,2631
To: Phil Dunn 74017,614 (X)

We would like to test this product if you're still interested in getting some
feedback.  Northwestern University Library has the hardware, and we're curre
currently doing a number of things with this technology.  I'm currently also
presently principal investigator on a Research Libraries Group-funded project
dealing with the general issue of university policy development in the area of
providing access to machine-readable data files generally, so your datasets
would be very useful to look at in that context.
                                               Brian Nielsen, Head Reference
Department and Coordinator of Research [phone]

#: 842 S1/General Information
    06-Jul-88  08:55:23
Sb: #cd-rom vaporware
Fm: J.S. Frentzen 76117,2127
To: all

In the process of gathering CD-ROM products for review in CD-ROM Review
magazine, I came across an inordinately large number of vendors who are
marketing their products -- in special interest publications -but simply do not
have any products in hand to ship to customers. At this point, I don't want to
name names... anyone who subscribes to CD-ROM Review's Continuous Information
Service knows who they are, and the situation is so grave that I've been given
a chance to create an article on the subject to be published in an upcoming
issue of CD-ROM Review.
  The point is, is vaporware in the CD-ROM market being treated like one of
those things to be swept under the rug? So many are higher than a kite on the
proposed "booming" CD-ROM market that hasn't really materialized yet, except
for a handful of companies selling to Fortune 500 companies. There are
manufacturers out there who simply do not have anything to show for their
marketing efforts. How long can this ostrich-theory attitude persist before the
house of cards falls on the CD-ROM market? I'm putting this message out to see
if there are any professionals or laypersons who have similar fears. -- Jeff

There is 1 Reply.

#: 843 S1/General Information
    06-Jul-88  16:35:55
Sb: #842-cd-rom vaporware
Fm: mike obryan 71410,340
To: J.S. Frentzen 76117,2127 (X)

Jeff, you know my attitude, a bird in hand etc., etc.  Seems to be a lot of hot
air abounding and is definetely a hindrance to the industry.  If ya ain't got
it don't flaunt it!!
                 Mike

#: 844 S1/General Information
    06-Jul-88  22:10:16
Sb: UMI Bus.Periodicals
Fm: Brian Nielsen 72411,2631
To: All

                                        July 5 A test product from UMI,
"Business Periodicals Ondisc", was installed at Northwestern University Library
this Spring.  We received two systems, with some variation in hardware and
software setup, which provide for laser-printed output of a year's worth (at
present Jan - Dec 1987, but being added to quarterly) of 60 business
periodicals -- full text and graphics.  The periodical data are on 17 CD-ROMs
for each system.  Search and retrieval of the data is accomplished with UMI's
ABI/INFORM CD-ROM, which has been marketed since January.  Users are provided a
message at the bottom of the monitor screen when the full text for the
abstracted article is in the database; if they want to print the article, they
are prompted to put the appropriate CD-ROM in the drive, they put their
photocopy debit card into a debit card reader, and presto, full text and
pictures.  UMI's software being shipped this month also provides for
display/printing of each journal issue's table of contents, and retrieval of
articles from the BPO CD-ROM from this access point (including such features as
editorials, columns, and letters to the editor which are not always indexed in
the ABI/INFORM database).

Hardware for systems: both juZ on NCR "PC 8" 80386 machines, and use Canon
LBP-8II laser printers, two internal Toshiba CD-ROM drives in each (one for the
ABI/INFORM, one to swap in data disks) running under MS-DOS Extensions. Each
system also has a Canon BJ-80AP "bubble jet"printer for printing just the
abstract data from the ABI/INFORM disk (this is the same quiet printer that UMI
provides with the marketed ABI system).  Our test site has a different setup on
each of the systems for display: System A has a NEC Multisync EGA monitor, and
allows display of only the ABI data (full text on printer only, in other
words).  System B has a Princeton LM-301 high-resolution monitor, allowing the
display onscreen of a full page of the image data on request; the image can be
zoomed in, allowing for easy reading, or simply scanned for general
appropriateness before making the print request.  Print quality on these
systems is favorably comparable to a reasonably good

#: 845 S1/General Information
    06-Jul-88  22:12:13
Sb: UMI Business Contd.
Fm: Brian Nielsen 72411,2631
To: All

Continuation of #844 photocopy one would get in a library from the journal
paper copy, and the initial pricing of the prints for the test is identical to
what we charge for photocopier use throughout the building ($.067/page); UMI
will be fiddling with the pricing through the year.

Both librarian and first user reaction is of course HOLY COW!  It's nifty.

#: 846 S1/General Information
    07-Jul-88  00:25:19
Sb: First Hypercard CD-ROM
Fm: Peter Black 74240,265
To: All

It is called Time Table of Science and Innovation. It boasts 5700 stories
defining the key events in the History of scientific and technical
accomplishment. There are over 1000 linked graphics (some dynamic) and sounds.
It is further enhanced by the XIPHIAS Xearch~ XCMD, which allows access to any
one of the stories in less than a few seconds, and allowed the implementation
of the 'Hot Words' concept.

Every word is 'hot', that is, linked automatically by means of the search
engine, to every other story that shares the word. Find a story on Edison, and
the word electricity might catch your eye. A click on that word immediately
yields a list of every story with the word electricity, sorted chronologically.
The notion is Hypermedia, and it fulfills the classic Ted Nelson prediction of
non-linear writing and 'intertwingledness'. In layman's language, it is new and
a good bit of fun.

If you are interested contact Sue Black at XIPHIAS [phone]. Or write to
same at 13464 Washington Blvd., Marina Del Rey, CA  90292

#: 847 S3/CDROM Applications
    07-Jul-88  01:20:14
Sb: #840-CD-ROM video
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To: CHUCK SMITH 71641,3411 (X)

Chuck,

The CD-ROM standard tells how to store data, but not what kind (sound, video,
stills, text, etc.) or how to retrieve it.  The problem is that digital video
images take up an enormous amount of space on a CD-ROM, giving you about 6-9
minutes of motion video...if it could out put those images fast enough (30
frames/sec for motion video).  The data transfer rate as defined by the CD-ROM
standard would allow only about 2-4 frames per second, which is not enough for
motion video.

Not a very rosey picture, but the answer lies in data compression.  The video
images would be compressed prior to being mastered onto a CD-ROM, and then
decoded at playback by the host computer.  Several companies are currently
working on this angle (SOCS Research, David Sarnoff Research Center, Lotus,
JVW, and others).

No standards exist at this point in time, however.

-- Michael --

#: 848 S3/CDROM Applications
    07-Jul-88  01:23:35
Sb: Standards?
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To: Mark 71330,467 (X)

Mark,

The current release of Hypercard (version 1.2.1) supports the Apple CD-ROM
drive, and allows access to the drive via the AppleTalk local area network.  It
is a SCSI drive that also plays standard CD audio discs, which can be playing
in the background while the computer is doing other tasks.  It is available
now, as is their CD-ROM drive.

Your comment about Apple's "Apple's philosophy is to standardize everything,
and although there are certainly benefits to that approach, it does limit
developers and users.." makes little sense.  Quite the contrary,
standardization makes everybody's life a little easier, for developers and
users.

I recently tried to connect a Sony CD-ROM player to a DOS compatible machine,
and had nothing but problems.  Wrong device drivers, incompatible BIOS, wrong
version of Windows, wrong version of DOS, wrong DIP settings, incompatible
monitors and/or graphic cards, etc. made my initial enthusiasm fade rapidly.
The whole thing took over 3 weeks to get up and running.

Standards?  I wish the DOS world had more of them.

-- Michael --

#: 849 S3/CDROM Applications
    07-Jul-88  01:24:37
Sb: #Answers...
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To:  71131,1564 (X)

Steve, excuse me for butting in, but I have some info that you may find useful:

1. Analog images are currently the most efficient way to archive high quality
images due to the fact that analog images take up less room on an optical disc
than digital images do, and they don't need to be "digitized" prior to
inclusion on the disc.  You need to have thousands of images for motion video,
where the frames are output at 30 per second (that's 1,800 per minute, every
one being a different image).  LaserVideo (LV) discs and Compact Disc-Video
(CD-V) currently use analog encoding for storage of images.  Some LV's use
digital soundtracks; all CD-V's do.

2. The output from a videodisc player has the capability of a very high degree
of resolution.  Remember that a videodisc player was designed for playback via
a standard TV set, or monitor with composite video input, and it was designed
for playback of full motion images.  The Mac is capable of some pretty good
imaging itself.  The standard configuration is 640 x 480 with 256 colors out of
a palette of over 16 million on the Mac II screen.  I have seen some stuff
digitized with the Sharp JX-450 color scanner that looked real good to me.
Additionally, you can use one of several 24 bits video boards for the Mac II,
along with a 19" Trinitron monitor, and you'll have near-photographic quality
images on the screen.

Hope this helps.  What specifically do you need to accomplish (full motion or
still image storage), or are you just curious?

-- Michael --

There is 1 Reply.

#: 850 S1/General Information
    07-Jul-88  13:19:46
Sb: CD-ROM video
Fm: Dave Pushic 74775,1345
To: CHUCK SMITH 71641,3411 (X)

Chuck,

Why motion video for a history curriculum with manuscript images? Is motion
truly necessary for your application?  If not, you can store a hell of a lot of
digitized still images on a cdrom, pulling them off into a video
digitizer/capture board.



#: 851 S1/General Information
    07-Jul-88  13:24:40
Sb: #standards?
Fm: Dave Pushic 74775,1345
To: Michael Murray 71616,214 (X)

Michael,

Maybe part of your problem was your choice of CD-ROM players. The Philips
CD-ROM player is available with an SCSI interface for PC/XT/AT's, as well as
with a high speed serial interface.  Mine took me about 10 minutes to set up on
a DELL (ne PC's Limitted) clone.

Regards,

Dave Pushic

There are 2 Replies.

#: 852 S1/General Information
    07-Jul-88  21:20:33
Sb: #851-standards?
Fm: mike obryan 71410,340
To: Dave Pushic 74775,1345 (X)

Just for general information for anyone interested I've used the Amdek
Laserdrive-1 on an AST 286 and later a Maxar 386.  The setup on both machines
took less than 10 minutes and went off without a hitch.  The Amdek is the same
as the Hitachi drive I think. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong.

#: 853 S1/General Information
    08-Jul-88  00:25:45
Sb: #851-#standards?
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To: Dave Pushic 74775,1345 (X)

Dave,

Could be; I'm sure each manufacturer has it's own setup routine.  Things seem
to be getting easier, from what I've been able to see.  Are the SCSI drives
easier to work with?  The Sony we had required a very specific controller card
& software to work properly.

-- Michael --

There are 2 Replies.

#: 854 S3/CDROM Applications
    08-Jul-88  10:46:46
Sb: #WORMS
Fm: David Donaldson 76340,1652
To: ALL

Non CD owner, interested is MASS storage and retrieval. WORMS seem to be the
anwser. Hope I'll get some info here.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 855 S3/CDROM Applications
    08-Jul-88  12:14:52
Sb: #854-WORMS
Fm: Phil Dunn 74017,614
To: David Donaldson 76340,1652

David -

One important key to WORM vs CD-ROM decision is distribution of replicates.

If you have lots of data (50 Megabytes+) to distribute to lots of people (50+)
then CD-ROM may be the way to go.

If you want to save and access MASS stuff locally... WORM is great.

CD-ROM is a _distribution_ medium. Great for acquiring outside data. Or
distributing your data to others.

The two are not really competitive media.

What's your application?

Phil

Hopkins Technology

#: 856 S1/General Information
    08-Jul-88  16:10:27
Sb: #853-#standards?
Fm: Dave Pushic 74775,1345
To: Michael Murray 71616,214 (X)

Michael,

The biggest advantage to SCSI interfaced drives is the ability to control and
access more than 1 device.  I believe the SCSI standard allows 8 devices
(counting the host as 1), which means the same controller card can be used for
a number of daisy-chained CD-ROM drives, hard disk storage, streaming tape
backups, etc.

Although SCSI does provide some measure of standardization, the truth is that
the "normal" drive interfaces are all different between the various
manufacturers.  Although CD-ROM established a physical standard for the read
mechanisms and discs, the was no standardization of file structure until High
Sierra (ne ISO 9660) and is yet no standardization of interface, commands, etc.
SCSI is a start in this direction.



There is 1 Reply.

#: 857 S1/General Information
    08-Jul-88  20:20:07
Sb: #816-CDROM's
Fm: Arthur Mrozowski 71531,124
To: RUSSELL BRUDNICKI 76064,2452

Hi. My name is Arthur and I work for Meridian Data. We currently have drivers
for MS DOS, High Sierra and ISO 9660 drivers. If you are interested our address
is 1239 Linda Vista Dr San Marcos, CA 92069 Phone [phone]

#: 858 S3/CDROM Applications
    09-Jul-88  10:19:26
Sb: #849-Answers...
Fm: Steve Hannaford 71131,1564
To: Michael Murray 71616,214 (X)

Micheal-

Lucid description and I thank you!  Actually I'm writing about optical disks
for MacWeek.  I just had never had a good description of the difference between
analog and digital.

While I understand well what digital storage involves, I still don't understand
exactly how an analogue image is stored on a disk, if not as a bit-map.  If it
is stored as a full image. as on tape or film, how does the laser read it all
to "project it".  For instance, how are colors stored analogically?

I'm in the curious position of someone who understands the "advanced"
technology pretty well, but not the earlier version.

#: 859 S3/CDROM Applications
    09-Jul-88  14:52:24
Sb: #834-ALDE CDROM DISC
Fm: Berkeley MUG 70007,2271
To: Noboru Toyoshima 76662,330 (X)

Noboru -

Good to hear from you again.  Yes, I remember meeting you at the CD ROM
conference.

The PD ROM is not yet available, but it should be out soon.  Ask again in a
couple of weeks.

-- Raines Cohen / BMUG

#: 860 S1/General Information
    09-Jul-88  17:09:17
Sb: #853-standards?
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To: Michael Murray 71616,214 (X)

Dave,

Yes, I agree that the SCSI standard will provide a higher level compatibility
among CD-ROM manufacturers.  SCSI is alreay firmly entrenched in the Macintosh
community, what with all machines having a built-in SCSI port (from the Mac
Plus on up).  Hopefully the DOS world will come together as well.

-- Michael --

#: 861 S1/General Information
    09-Jul-88  17:18:14
Sb: SCSI
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To: Dave 74775,1345

Dave,

Yes, I agree that the SCSI standard will provide a higher level compatibility
among CD-ROM manufacturers.  SCSI is alreay firmly entrenched in the Macintosh
community, what with all machines having a built-in SCSI port (from the Mac
Plus on up).  Hopefully the DOS world will come together as well.

-- Michael --

#: 862 S1/General Information
    09-Jul-88  19:46:58
Sb: More info...
Fm: Michael Murray 71616,214
To: Steve Hannaford 71131,1564 (X)

Steve,

Optical media can store information in either analog or digital form. Let's say
you wanted to store a computer graphic (a bit map) on a CD-ROM disk.  A bit map
is by definition in the digital domain.  To get that bit map on a CD-ROM in
analog form, you would need to output the image to composite video and store it
on a CD-ROM in that format.  Now, how is the guy who has that CD-ROM image
going to get it into his PC, without some sort of a card that accepts composite
video input?  You need to consider what delivery system will be used to
retrieve the graphic.  It must have the same characteristics as the system used
to create the graphic.

Analog images are stored in the same fashion as on a Laserdisc.  There are
54,000 tracks on CAV-type Laserdiscs.  Each track is one frame of video
information, consequently it takes one full spin of the videodisc to retrieve
each frame.  The frame contains all the necessary components to properly
display the image.  This information is not stored as a series of pits binary),
but as standard analog values, similar to a vinyl record, or the old RCA
SelectaVision videodisc players.  These values are converted into electrical
impulses, which are fed to appropriate video circuitry for output (usually NTSC
standard composite video).  Analog is no doubt the choice for motion video, but
for computer-generated still images, designed to be read into a PC, digital
would be the medium of choice.

Hope this helps. Let me know what issue of MacWeek you'll be in! -- Michael --

#: 863 S3/CDROM Applications
    09-Jul-88  20:23:14
Sb: cdromvideo
Fm: CHUCK SMITH 71641,3411
To: Michael Murray, 71616,214 (X)

Michael, Your comments on CDROM video limitations pretty much confirm my
impression after reading what I could get my hands on--still, where a year ago
I was reading about compression ratios of 5 to 1, then 10 to one, then IBM's
WORM drive ads-23 to 1, and now a company in Oklahoma called TMS is sending me
info on "TMSFAX" and they're saying "40 to 1." I know the figures above refer
to black and white images, but are the companies you mentioned advancing at a
similar pace in video?\exit \exit

#: 864 S3/CDROM Applications
    09-Jul-88  20:30:05
Sb: cdromvideo
Fm: CHUCK SMITH 71641,3411
To: Dave Pushic 74775,1345

Dave, while video would be great, it's not absolutely necessary as you suggest.
However, funding may be available to me if the end product is a "multi-media"
(not necessarily including video!) and I have access to a mass of educational
materials (in Spanish, as I'm in Puerto Rico). I don't know enough about a
"video capture board." Is that a Targa? Where can I get info? Here I get only
what I sift from the magazines, and I'm a humanities prof., new to the
field./exit

#: 865 S1/General Information
    09-Jul-88  21:56:08
Sb: #856-standards?
Fm: Vic Wagner/Metadigm 76046,3004
To: Dave Pushic 74775,1345

SCSI allows 8 _controllers_ on the bus.  There is an additional allowance of up
to 8 'logical units' per controller.  This 'allows' for 56 additional devices
(assuming that the controllers are reasonable (and we all know how to parse
ass/u/me)).



#: 866 S1/General Information
    11-Jul-88  03:56:50
Sb: #legal storage
Fm: John McCormick 76360,44
To: all

does anyone have information about any court decisions accepting optical
storage of records as best evidence?

There is 1 Reply.

#: 867 S1/General Information
    11-Jul-88  07:32:41
Sb: #866-legal storage
Fm: Mark Schneider 71330,467
To: John McCormick 76360,44

The "Best Evidence Rule" is not taken very seriously by most courts; it is one
of those "rules" that is so riddled with exceptions that it is rarely an
obstacle to the introduction of any evidence.   It nominally applies when the
contents of a writing are in dispute, the so-called "original" must then be
produced.  In California courts a xerox copy is equivalent to an "original",
and computer data is routinely accepted into evidence upon a showing, if
challenged, that the output is reliable.

If you're thinking of converting paper business records to optical form, and
the opposing party objects to optical records, I'd think that at worst you'd
need expert testimony, which you yourself could provide, that the method of
conversion is accurate. A more "formidable" objection might be hearsay, and
you'd have to establish that your records are in law "business records", i.e.
prepared in the usual course of business, at or near the times of the
transactions they record, by someone who has the duty to prepare them, and not
prepared in contemplation of litigation.

A recent "megatrial" in the S.F. Bay area used massive WORM drives to store
scanned-in court documents, full-text and abstracts, which were then
retreivable at terminals at the many counsel tables.  If there WERE any
objections, "Best Evidence" or otherwise, they were overruled.